The Conservatives' new friends in Europe

It's inevitable that a Labour MEP blog site will attract Tory posters like bluebottles to rotten beef, not that I regard the starting item as rotten beef.

There are two remarkable things here. Firstly, the curious allies the Tories are shacking up with in order not to shack with their natural allies in the European Parliament, the more orthodox conservative parties. They are doing this because the latter buy into the European "mission" or at least do not oppose it with the vigour of the Eurosceptics. This alliance between the French and Germans (and others, but these are the main drivers) is seen as blocking change to the structure and policies of the European Commission and Parliament. These new allies of the Tories are inevitably from the new arrivals, and so mostly from Eastern Europe. They indeed are some pretty obnoxious bedfellows.

Secondly, the extraordinary assertion that Euro-sceptics do not want to leave the EU. All they ask ever for is a referendum - for what, to endorse continued membership? No, you muppets, to start the ball for leaving it.

Everyone accepts that assembling a coalition of common interest in a Parliament comprised numerous parties is going to be tricky at the best of times, and nobody can dispute that one or two of Labour's allies are not saints. Hardly a surprise that some had a communist past during communism. But Cameron does not disavow the racists, homophobes and holocaust-deniers in his cobbled alliance and should do so.

The group the Tory party left were in favour of Lisbon and moves towards a more federal EU.

THe group the Tory party are now in are opposed to Lisbon and any further moves to federalism.

Can you please explain the logic of staying in a grouping 180% opposite to the main plank of Tory policy on the EU i.e. no to Lisbon and no to federalism?

Maybe the Labour party can switch it's position at will to suit political power (the referendum vote seems to show that's the case) but it's nice to see a party that won't

No, the majority of posters dont want to withdraw from the EU, I certainly don't unless it is completely beyond reform. Please link posts showing the "majority" of right wing posters want to leave?

I would point out that a sizeable % of the population voted for parties who do want to leave the EU. That sizeable minority was actually larger than the Labour vote so maybe less complaining and more reasoning?

The majority have also not said they want to pay no taxes. Again please link where lots of people have said this?

I have said I am happy to pay a reasonable level of taxation for the "greater good" but that I don't regard 50% as reasonable. You take a position where everyone is either in favour of taxation or against it which is gross over simplification.

On your third point, again please link where posters have called for "NO government...". I'm here a lot and I haven't seen that yet?

Most right wing posters call for less or smaller government, but again you take a position that it's "all or nothing".

By the way, I'm not posting on a socialist or Tory line here, I'm posting on a "don't shoot scatter gun generalities about that are completely unfounded".

You seem to have the intellectual capacity of one of Red Ken's newts

Thanks Guy M for getting in the socialist line, and getting the majority of comments here wrong

The majority want to withdraw from the EU. The majority express a desire to pay NO taxes. A majority talk about NO government except for border guards and police. A majority of the opinions expressed here are way to the RIGHT of Conservative party policy

But at least you're trying

Very trying

The mainstream views posted here from Tory posters are pretty much in line with Tory party policy. Smaller government, non federalist EU, lower taxes when appropriate, balanced book on the economy.

If you look at socialist ideology then you find the views that are not "mainstream views" in the UK.

I think anyone wanting to talk about "mainstream public views" should take a long hard look at voting and polling figures before spouting Labour or socialist dogma.

Another ATT troll post that's fact-lite

I noticed that too. And don't let them kid you 'It's not the tories, it's the public'. The mainstream of views posted here are nothing like the mainstream views in the country.

I may be wrong, because I have not read "Belgian Adventures" (the English edition of "Avonturen van een Nederbelg") but from searching through Google it seems to have been a wry, well-received book on Belgium from the point of view of a Dutchman. The author appears to have contrasted the two countries. You (or your source) appear to have taken a few lines out of context.

For example:
“As a Dutchman living in Flanders I have the impression that the life of a white, heterosexual Dutchman with a good job and an expensive car is not easy. He has to pay taxes and has to shut up. He gets blamed for racial and sexual discrimination, the fact that he earns much money is deemed ‘anti-social’ and his car pollutes the environment. As he does not belong to any minority group, he is ‘unlucky’. Soon he will have to pay penance for slavery.”

This looks to me like a contrast between the position of men in Dutch society (highly political correct) and Belgian society (less so). It's nothing to do with diversity.

I note that Mr Eppink worked for the commission at the time the book was published. If he were a sexist, racist xenophobe, I think we'd have heard a bit more about him before now.

Pardon? Are you suggesting that because I dislike GB and voice my opinion on that subject often that I am all of a sudden Conservative minded?

Sorry, but the comments you view as 'rubbish' happen to be a good insight into how people are thinking, no matter where their political allegiance is. I may dislike the negative aspects of the comments posted, but at the very least it gives all of us a broad opinion of how articles are recieved. Rather than waste time debating whether to ban those of a Conservative mind, why not do what many Labour minded people are doing - read the comments, understand different points of view and where possible debate the issue in an adult manner?

You can not have a debate if everyone agrees and yes, this is a site for the Labour minded, but without views from across the political spectrum there would be nowhere near the diverse number of opinions and expertise we witness here every day.

Not only do you have an issue with debate, but you obviously have problems counting. Or perhaps you haven't done your research?

Whatever the answer, do you not see the irony of your comments that those of a Labour mind are not posting when a lot of your posts don't address the article, but rather highlight the number of Conservative minds here?

If people wanted pan european parties they would exist !

If you think otherwise, then what on earth do you think is stopping people getting together and creating them ?

I expect foreign countries to be run for the benefit of the people who live there, according to how they want to live. I neither want nor need any control over how they run their own internal matters - equally I don't expect them to interfere with mine. Pan-national parties are just perverse.

If you would prefer to be under an other countries government - go live there! if you think they would be better under ours then campaign for a return to colonialism.

You are right we need if not pan-national parties, then some sort of cross border empathy at the citizen level.

At the minute we are sold the idea that the overriding issue is Nationality. It seems to be completely off the radar that someone in Britain could have more in common with a person in Germany or France than someone who just happens to live in the same country as them.

If Mr Eppink's book claims "“young ambitious women” are linked to “social frustration” among men", maybe he should have a chat with Laurie Penny. Her article a few days ago was saying the exact same thing.

Mark,

I'm flattered you think I am from CCHQ. I'm heartily sick of Labour's self-appointed moral authority and I am delighted on seeing them up-ended like this.

It's odd but the most cogent and rational argument are not coming from the Labour contributors but from us.

As to what you do - how about argue your case rather than complain?

Leaving aside the hysterics, two comments:


1. EUrosceptics don't want to withdraw from the EU, but to reform it: stopping and reversing the onward march towards 'ever-closer union' and a nascent supra-national, federalist super-state.

2. The EU will - after a bit of arm-twisting - accept these changes because:
a) The EUneeds Britain - a major nett contributor the EU - to be a member. Who else will make up the budget? Not Germany or the Netherlands....
b) They need to trade with us and sell us their goods and services. We are, after all, the 4th largest economy. Is the EU really going to cut off its nose to spite its face?

Do you actually think that Conservative central office would bother deluging labour sites with negative comments? As far as I can see there are only maybe 20 different commenters on this site. Probably 80% are negative. Let's see now, Labour apparently commands about 15% of the national vote, only 38% actually voted in the EU elections. This means that only 5% of the public supports Labour enough to vote. So to get only 80-90% negative comments is probably an achievement of sorts.

You see? Its not the Tories, its THE PUBLIC! Get it through your head that Labour are the "nasty party", have done untold harm to the economy and the country and have their heads firmly in the sand as you show. This is from a former Labour voter.

no, you don't want them. that doesn't mean that no-one wants them. I haven't seen any research on the matter that claims public opinion to be either for or against pan-European parties. If there is any do post a link...

Surely the point isn’t who the Tories have chosen for an alliance but who they are excluding.

They are excluding (and alienating) the main Right of Centre parties – and more often than not Governments.

It shows that far from winning the arguments in Europe they have withdrawn from engagement from the very people they should be aligned with. The Euro extremists who demanded this and who Dave is indebted to hope this will be the first step to withdrawal from the EU.

That is why the announcement was made yesterday – a day they knew would be dominated by the Speaker election
That is why William Hague the man who should be championing this is nowhere to be seen backing up the rumours that he is against this.

The real issue is that if the Tories won the next election, the Euro sceptics would be back in charge, with their UKIP allies demanding renegotiation of the Lisbon Treaty followed by withdrawal from the EU.

The Labour party needs to stand up for the EU, pointing out the disaster that will befall the economy if we withdrew, whole industries would disappear from the UK, millions of people would be unemployed for generations as foreign investment dried up and exports had no markets.

For those that live in LaLa land; a return to 1972 is not a possibility as the remaining members would seize the opportunity to exclude the UK from trade with the EU, we wouldn’t get the concessions Norway and Switzerland get.

"The conservative new friends in Europe"


Question - is "Dave" removing himself from Europe as it gets its act together on climate change and financial regulation. The FT seems to think so.


Question - is "Dave" isolating himself from our No.1 ally the U.S. The FT seems to think so. It says that Obama wants Europe to be its partner in the world, and not just the U.K. he is spreading his love.... why are the Tories going in the other direction.....they need to giving more love - outwards.?

You are coming around to realising why the EU is ill conceived.

You just need to take the next step and realise why Pan European parties don't exist.

The socialist solution would be to make them exist (requiring a grouping to have 8 different countries is a step in this direction) - the free market solution is to say "noone wants them - don't wast my money trying to create them, you can't buck the market/public".

Hmmm... as a lonely, racist, sexist and homophobe, let's look at PES...

Let's start with the Portuguese socialists, these geniuses in foreign policy and their anti-colonial angst created the crisis in Angola, Mozambique and East Timor leading to the deaths of tens of thousands of people.

Now about the Czech socialists, well they have the dubious honour of being more corrupt in power than the Communists ever were, there are still unresolved issues between 1998 and 2002 that makes UK MPs expenses look like the work of naive children.

Their next-door neighbours, the Solvak socialists are formed from the former communist party under the guise of 'social democracy' amongst their number are active politicians who were very happy to see the Soviet jackboot suppress the freedoms of their countrymen and govern as part of the Soviet installed puppet government.

Same with the Hungarian socialists that Labour choose to sit with as well including politicians found guilty of tax evasion and corruption. Accusations of some politicians also stretch to conducting espionage for the Russians. Nice to know that our government associates with the seedier elements of the old Bear itself.

The Latvian socialists contain elements of the old puppet communist regime.

The Romanian socialists have some particularly nasty characters, ex-Stalinists, allegations of corruption, fraud, intimidation of opposition politicians and supporters. Happy to use mob rule and violence to suppress debate and demonstration.

The Bulgarian socialists, their means of debate is poison tipped umbrellas.

So in PES there is a large group of people happy to act as proxies for Soviet power and the suppression of free-speech, freedom of assembly and democratic freedom, ex-Stalinist, ex-Marxist. Found guilty of voter intimidation, proven guilt or allegations of corruption, fraud, espionage and with blood on their hands of tens of thousands of people.

So if you are an enemy of freedom, support corruption, fraud, voter intimidation and can turn a blind eye to genocide - vote Labour.

The real problem is that funding is withdrawn for those MEPs who are not members of groups. This leads to hotch-potch groups political parties with no real connection perhaps other than some vague crossovers between policies.

What we need are pan-european parties, independent of national parties. Otherwise, as we saw just recently in many member states, people vote solely on the basis of national issues not European issues. How many voters in the UK actually know anything about the stance of the PES or EPP on any issue? Hardly any, because they vote for national parties on national issues. That kind of defeats the object of a European Parliament.

Mike, the problem with the contributions on this site and many others is that Tory central office has a strategy ‘influence public opinion’ via message boards.
What we are seeing is a co-ordinated attempt to flood various sites to make it appear that the Tories have won the arguments. An interesting strategy they seem to have copied from the Chinese Communist party.

They come in a variety of flavours, but they will normally highlight ‘New’ Labour (or (NuLabour), personal attacks on Gordon Brown, and the Slogan of the moment Election Now!

It’s a tough call, do you ban them and get accused of censorship or allow your site to be throttled by the rubbish posted, alienating the people the site was intended for?

I have to say it Mike your argument is nonexistent. How many times do you have to be told that their are two sides to an argument? If the Labour argument was stronger then you would win and the Tories would be off with their tales in between their legs.

The Internet means that arguments become bigger with more input and a better result. Hence the labour debate is nonexistent because no sane INFORMED AND INTELLIGENT person would want to put their name to it.

Unless articles are well written with sound points that are well argued then they get taken apart along with the author. This is where LL needs to look to a different source of writers. Writing articles comes from a desire to communicate, push your agenda and EGO! People over time in reading all the comments have no desire to put their heads above the parapet.

My conclusion Labour is politically and ideologically flawed. Blair found a ground to get elected, he's gone and with the current PLP and policies, Labour - are finished until somebody takes the mantle of starting again from scratch.

Anyway back to you - Instead of posting crap about it's all Tories here how about some constructive comments, some ideas that people can discuss? Thought not.

I'm voting Tory but in reality I'd like to vote for a labour party that was totally different to the stinking pile of dog poo that is the PLP. Instead of being the party of the people - they are self obsessed, war mongering, cash squandering, economy and country wreckers.

This is beyond parody, and one can only conclude that someone has broken into an MEP's email account and starting sending deranged mail to discredit them. If we're supposed to judge the Tories by the people they sit with in the EU parliament, only someone trying to discredit the Labour Party could imply that they are proud of sitting with a man whose party leader said ``At the beginning of his activities, Hitler had a really good programme. He put Germany on its feet and eliminated unemployment … I don’t know what happened to him later ... who had such influence over him that he moved toward genocide''. Clearly, no-one rational would deduce from that quote that Mary Honeyball is an apologist for Hitler, just because she sits with Mr Bogdan Golik of Samoobrona. So I assume that the real Mary Honeyball (crazy name, crazy gal) will be along shortly to renounce this arrant nonsense.

It's possible, of course, that she's the real MEP, and she's serious. In which case she can start explaining why, given the Labour Party draped itself in red banners and attempted to learn to pronounce Solidarnosc through the eighties, why it's now sitting with Democratic Left Alliance MEPs who are mostly former CP hacks. Ditto Czech Social Democrats, who are in large part former CP members: is eastern bloc communism of the 1980s better then being a bit sexist? Perhaps you'd like to spot which out of a few nutty Dutchmen and the Czech and Polish CP held the most political prisoners, eh?

So are you asking the moderators to remove any post that doesn't agree with Labour thinking?

Mike, if all LL can offer is the sort of inane rants from Mary Honeyball and Ms Penny is it any wonder people in general avoid LL?

The only reason I'm still here is a fascination with the train crash that is the Labour party at the moment.

To see Labour MEPs posting the sort of nonsense this thread contains is frankly almost beyond belief.

Mike, support for Labour is down to 5%, perhaps get some of your friends here to redress the balance.

Mary, have a referendum and you'll find all your problems magically disappear. And Labour are the Nasty Party now; just look at the Iraq War Inquiry fiasco.

Of the posts so far, all but one are from identified Tories.

Basically, Labour-minded people are drifting away from this site - are the moderators too dim to realise what is happening?

Aha! Now we see the true face of David Cameron! His MEPs will be sitting with Polish homophobes, Stalinist nostalgics, an old IRA man and a 9/11 conspiracy theorist who travels the Muslim world arguing that the twin towers were brought down by Israel. Oh no - hang on: those are the people that British Labour MEPs are currently sitting with.

Let's try again. From next month, Conservative MEPs will be sitting with a Spanish party whose leader refuses to disown Francoism, a German party that campaigned against immigration under the slogan "Children, not Indians!", the partners of an Austrian party nostalgic for the Third Reich, an Italian neo-fascist movement and several anti-gay and anti-gipsy parties. Oops: wrong again! That's the EPP - the federalist bloc which the Tories are about to leave.

Your article is nothing but disgusting smears, I thought after draper and watson you people learnt your lesson.

Are you Ms Penny in disguise Mary Honeyball? I think we should know.

If you weren't aware, Ms Penny wrote a marvellous thread which basically accused white middle class men of being the "problem" causing inequalities in society.

Given that feminist attack is it hardly surprising that some white middle class men might agree with:

“As a Dutchman living in Flanders I have the impression that the life of a white, heterosexual Dutchman with a good job and an expensive car is not easy. He has to pay taxes and has to shut up. He gets blamed for racial and sexual discrimination, the fact that he earns much money is deemed ‘anti-social’ and his car pollutes the environment. As he does not belong to any minority group, he is ‘unlucky’. Soon he will have to pay penance for slavery.”

I have to say that quote seems about spot on to be honest. People like you Mary and Ms Penny would have me blamed for all the inequalities in society, bring in racial discrimination against whites, sexual discrimination against men and yet would like us to shut up and keep working to pay the taxes you desperately need to fund your grandiose socialist and EU federalist nonsense.

It should also be pointed out that Mr Eppink is a "former senior European Commission official", perhaps you could complain to the EU about the standard of its officials if you feel that strongly?

I would also refrain from getting into debates about Latvia. The Latvians had decades of communist rule by Russia where they were treated as second class citizens. Were you so vocal in your opposition to the USSR, or were you supporting racist policies against ethnic Latvians?

The grouping that the Tory Party has formed has one clear overriding common purpose, to end the federalist march the EU is on. I am not surprised that sitting in Brussels hoovering up expenses this must seem extreme to you but to the UK public you lost any moral position when you lied, schemed, twisted and weaselled your way out of a vote on the Lisbon treaty.

I do hope that someone takes a look at your comment "So if you are a sexist, a racist, a homophobe, or a combination of these and you are lonely, join the Conservatives: the place to find extremist friends" and takes you to court. My reply would be simple, "if you're below average IQ, low educational standard and want to sit on benefits for most of your life watching daytime tv then join Labour, the place to find dim witted friends and MEPs"

Oh and by the way, "Derk-Jan’s views on Dutch women border on the racist" is one of the most inane comments I've seen in a while. His views, if he is anti-women, border on SEXISM not RACISM, or have the Labour party now defined women as a race?

Another Labour feminista chucking "racism" accusations about without letting their brains kick in.

The more you read LL threads from Labour MEPs the more you have to wonder if the whole lot of them were found in a local asylum.

Is it sexist to point out that this article is a tad hysterical?

"So if you are a sexist, a racist, a hompohobe, or a combination of these and you are lonely, join the Conservatives: the place to find extremist friends."

So first of all its the BNP, attack them and Labour will win. That didn't work so now it is the Conservatives. What do you really hope to achieve with an article like this? And are you really an MEP representing the interests of the British people?

For the love of all that is holy, please start to concentrate on a positive and practical message. Have you ever been in business? One of the first things you learn is not to slag off the competition, eventually it either comes back to bite you or if you make a mistake similar to that of your competition, you lose all trust with your customer. Learn the lesson from the Euro elections. You don't win an arguement by slinging mud at people, you do it by making positive policies and then backing them up as soon as is practically possible.

There is so much you could do, so many things you could present to the LL that is positive. Why is article after article all about negative aspects? Where are the new policies that Labour supporters can get behind? Where are the solutions or even an attempt at solutions to problems we have right now?

Nah, thats too hard isn't it? Better that the Labour Party spend their time convincing you that a vote for any other party makes you sexist, racist or a homophobe. Well done, let everyone know when you want an applause won't you?

Before you all start getting excited (some already have) and start claiming that this is what the people of this nation want, please remember that the turn out was only 34.71%, so you could not say it is what the people of this country want really. You would be more factual to say may the 27.7% who voted for the Tory party wanted.

It is true that the Tory party won a greater percentage of the vote, it is not true that the WHOLE country wanted today’s outcome.

I don’t know maybe I am trying to be too factual?

So if you are a sexist, a racist, a hompohobe, or a combination of these and you are lonely, join the Conservatives: the place to find extremist friends

Alex,

I am truly seething; this is possibly the lowest of anything published on this site. It's gutter politics from someone who is in office and should quite frankly know better. As the editor and I feel that you must distance yourself from this and solicit an apology from this person.

Regards,
bb J.

"Derk-Jan’s views on Dutch women border on the racist"

Women are a race now?

You might want to check out the Swedish Feminists who believe that mariage should be banned as it is "oppression of the female" and that there should be a special tax on men to recompense women for the violence men exclusively inflict on society.

Good old Labourlist. Never fails to entertain with moonbat idiotry

Mike,

You should read up on who Labour and the Lib Dems are in with. There are nutters in there too.

I think this new group is quite refreshing. Finally a party has listened to what the public want which is more sovereignty for our national parliament and less power for Europe. They want action on the immigration issue. People talk about the free movement of labour as something that is here to stay and there's no discussion on it. Some people in this country don't think its right that ANY European can come and work in this country - hence the rise of Xenophobia in the Euro elections.

It is nice to see a party willing to take some flack to appropriately represent their views and policies. I think there is much to change in Europe and hopefully this will be the first step.

bb J - I think the article itself demonstrates that at least one halfwit imbecile doesn't know that the tories are not supporting those views. Unless she is telling fibs and knows full well that she is trying to be misleading - but who will be misled? I suspect noone, everyone knows the truth, it is just some people want to lie about it to give themselves something to say...

I can see why support for labour MEPs fell throught the floor at the recent election.

Its a shame the few remaining ones still don't seem to get the message...

ha ha ha - not its not a shame really, it is a source of amusement and joy - ha ha ha

bb J, I agree with your comment.
Mary Honeyball MEP, is this the best you can do? Or are you just parroting the tribal Labour Line. I would have hoped that that politicians could do better, or are you just hoping to curry favour with Labour top table. Is this what you really think?

Mr Eppink is clearly a wally. Get over it.

And the “white, heterosexual Dutchman” comment is pure Laurie Penny, but that's alright because she's a she, and only men are sexist. Apparently.

Read the group declaration and look at how the Euro elections turned out. After this carry on being a Lab supporter and wonder why your heading for oblivion. Its called party of idiots that don't listen to the electorate; make stuff up and are generally flushing themselevs down the toilet. SYWWBY

THE PRAGUE DECLARATION OF PRINCIPLES OF THE EUROPEAN CONSERVATIVES AND REFORMISTS GROUP IN THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT

CONSCIOUS OF THE URGENT NEED TO REFORM THE EU ON THE BASIS OF EUROREALISM, OPENNESS, ACCOUNTABILITY AND DEMOCRACY, IN A WAY THAT RESPECTS THE SOVEREIGNTY OF OUR NATIONS AND CONCENTRATES ON ECONOMIC RECOVERY, GROWTH AND COMPETITIVENESS, THE EUROPEAN CONSERVATIVES AND REFORMISTS GROUP SHARES THE
FOLLOWING PRINCIPLES:

1. Free enterprise, free and fair trade and competition, minimal regulation, lower taxation, and small government as the ultimate catalysts for individual freedom and personal and national prosperity.
2. Freedom of the individual, more personal responsibility and greater democratic accountability.
3. Sustainable, clean energy supply with an emphasis on energy security.
4. The importance of the family as the bedrock of society.
5. The sovereign integrity of the nation state, opposition to EU federalism and a renewed respect for true subsidiarity.
6. The overriding value of the transatlantic security relationship in a revitalised NATO, and support for young democracies across Europe.
7. Effectively controlled immigration and an end to abuse of asylum procedures
8. Efficient and modern public services and sensitivity to the needs of both rural and urban communities.
9. An end to waste and excessive bureaucracy and a commitment to greater transparency and probity in the EU institutions and use of EU funds.
10. Respect and equitable treatment for all EU countries, new and old, large and small.

The "Nasty Party" attack is so lame - once again it shows that the beginning and end of Labour's policies are "Vote for us - We are not the Tory Party"


Before you throw accusations of being a Nasty Party around next time Mary, you might want to consider if the government has any case to answer with respect:

1. Invading Iraq
2. Dodgy dossier
3. Torture
4. Rendition Flights
5. Dodgy skewed inquiries
6. The rest - i.e. cash for peerages. Cash for changed laws. Smeargate etc...

A labour MEP bereft of a vision outside the Euro Super State and associated gravy train bleats here. For what purpose I wonder? The electorate has told you what they think of Europe. Can you respect democracy?

A halfwit imbecile knows that the Tories are not supporting these views; they are looking for people who share a view on HOW MUCH POWER EUROPE EXERTS over our lives. Why did you choose this when their stated aim is by group declaration is:

THE PRAGUE DECLARATION OF PRINCIPLES OF THE EUROPEAN CONSERVATIVES AND REFORMISTS GROUP IN THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT

CONSCIOUS OF THE URGENT NEED TO REFORM THE EU ON THE BASIS OF EUROREALISM, OPENNESS, ACCOUNTABILITY AND DEMOCRACY, IN A WAY THAT RESPECTS THE SOVEREIGNTY OF OUR NATIONS AND CONCENTRATES ON ECONOMIC RECOVERY, GROWTH AND COMPETITIVENESS, THE EUROPEAN CONSERVATIVES AND REFORMISTS GROUP SHARES THE
FOLLOWING PRINCIPLES:

1. Free enterprise, free and fair trade and competition, minimal regulation, lower taxation, and small government as the ultimate catalysts for individual freedom and personal and national prosperity.
2. Freedom of the individual, more personal responsibility and greater democratic accountability.
3. Sustainable, clean energy supply with an emphasis on energy security.
4. The importance of the family as the bedrock of society.
5. The sovereign integrity of the nation state, opposition to EU federalism and a renewed respect for true subsidiarity.
6. The overriding value of the transatlantic security relationship in a revitalised NATO, and support for young democracies across Europe.
7. Effectively controlled immigration and an end to abuse of asylum procedures
8. Efficient and modern public services and sensitivity to the needs of both rural and urban communities.
9. An end to waste and excessive bureaucracy and a commitment to greater transparency and probity in the EU institutions and use of EU funds.
10. Respect and equitable treatment for all EU countries, new and old, large and small.

It sickens me to the pit listening to the rubbish coming from Liebour.

A halfwit imbecile knows that the Tories are not supporting these views; they are looking for people who share a view on HOW MUCH POWER EUROPE EXERTS over our lives.

A labour MEP bereft of a vision outside the Euro Super State and associated gravy train bleats here. For what purpose I wonder? The electorate has told you what they think of Europe. Can you respect democracy?

No doubt we can expect loads of drivel posted by the “50 cent-ers” in the pay of Tory Party, as they try and distract from the real issue here.

The issue is that despite his posturing and fake attempts to create a “Clause4 moment”. Dave is in hoc to the Euro extremists in his party, this stupid move was pay back for support in his leadership election. This and his proposals to spend his first term fighting the Lisbon treaty rather than worrying about helping ordinary Britons fight the economic downturn (no change there then), shows what a sham the Tories are.

So the conservatives are the nasty party? that would be the party that most people voted for in the european elections and probably the party that will win the next general election.
Labour would be the "bend over in europe and take it from behind" party that didn't win.
Why not take a few minutes to think about what the people of this country want and why they voted conservative.

You lost me at "Nasty Party" which was, unfortunately, only a few words in.

Come back when you've matured sufficiently to enter into a debate above the level of name calling.